Text us. Share your thoughts. Ask Questions. We would love to hear from you.
Here's a bold statement for you - the C-suite is not immune to the Great Resignation. Yes, you heard that right, even CEOs are packing their bags and rethinking their professional lives. This episode unfolds the intriguing narrative of why CEOs are stepping down and the widening chasm between leaders and the workforce in the era of an employee's market. We delve into the undercurrents of this unexpected phenomenon and the implications of the pandemic on the employment landscape.
Now, what if we told you that the Harley-riding, boat-owning culture of the early 2000s has rippled into our current leadership styles? We'll talk about the growing tension and lack of connectivity between executives and employees, and how the former's approachability, emotional intelligence, and people skills could be a key to bridging this gap. We're not shying away from the hard-hitting questions either. We scrutinize the moral obligations of leaders, the pressures of executive compensation, and the ripple effects of these decisions on those they serve. Gear up for a no-holds-barred discussion about the changing dynamics of the workplace and what it really means to be a leader in this day and age.
Text us. Share your thoughts. Ask Questions. We would love to hear from you.
Here's a bold statement for you - the C-suite is not immune to the Great Resignation. Yes, you heard that right, even CEOs are packing their bags and rethinking their professional lives. This episode unfolds the intriguing narrative of why CEOs are stepping down and the widening chasm between leaders and the workforce in the era of an employee's market. We delve into the undercurrents of this unexpected phenomenon and the implications of the pandemic on the employment landscape.
Now, what if we told you that the Harley-riding, boat-owning culture of the early 2000s has rippled into our current leadership styles? We'll talk about the growing tension and lack of connectivity between executives and employees, and how the former's approachability, emotional intelligence, and people skills could be a key to bridging this gap. We're not shying away from the hard-hitting questions either. We scrutinize the moral obligations of leaders, the pressures of executive compensation, and the ripple effects of these decisions on those they serve. Gear up for a no-holds-barred discussion about the changing dynamics of the workplace and what it really means to be a leader in this day and age.
As a leader. When you start separating yourself from your team because you feel like now you've arrived, you're actually going to start degrading your team, because they start looking at you as if you don't feel like you're one of them.
Speaker 2:Welcome to First Lead you, a podcast dedicated to building leaders, expanding their capacity, improving their self-awareness through emotional intelligence and developing deeper understanding of selfless leadership.
Speaker 1:Hello America and welcome to First Lead you where we believe selfless leadership is essential. America is suffering a leadership crisis. Self-awareness and emotional intelligence is the key to developing selfless leaders.
Speaker 2:Now here is personal growth coach John Ballinger, Mr.
Speaker 3:Ford Mr Ballinger.
Speaker 1:How are you today?
Speaker 3:I'm doing great. How are you?
Speaker 1:I'm good Listen, I just played the throat guitar.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I know You've said that a couple of times. I'm not sure what that is actually.
Speaker 1:Well, actually it's the bass throat guitar. You know, people play the air guitar.
Speaker 3:Yes, I'm very familiar with air guitar.
Speaker 1:Yeah Well, you can actually, if you have a little bit of musical talent. While the music's playing, you can use your throat to play the guitar, but for me it was the bass. I was playing the bass start music, but Does it?
Speaker 3:require musical talent.
Speaker 1:Well, you've got to be able to follow the music and be in tune and things like that. But yeah, so you know, the audience knows I enjoy our music and today I was playing the throat bass guitar as we were. And you were laughing at me.
Speaker 3:I was. It was quite humorous. I appreciate you bringing levity to the situation.
Speaker 1:Well, you know, you got to have fun.
Speaker 3:Absolutely.
Speaker 1:Because we talk about a lot of serious topics and today is a very serious topic and today's number 22. My favorite number Two two Double deuce.
Speaker 3:Is it really yes?
Speaker 1:Oh, what's the story behind that? That was my number in high school. Oh, there you go Double deuce.
Speaker 3:There's more to that story, but I'll leave that for another day.
Speaker 1:Well, number 22 happens to be Ward Burton. Most probably don't know that name. You had a brother, Jeff Burton, that also drove in the mass car circuit.
Speaker 3:That sounds a little more familiar.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but Ward Burton, and Ward had a very thick Bostonian accent.
Speaker 1:So when he would say his name is kind of Ward Burton but yeah, he was a driver in the NASCAR and the time frame that I was really into NASCAR and for our audience we do have started kind of lightly calling these episodes one, two, three, four and then started naming them after NASCAR drivers During the time frame that I was a NASCAR fan. So you may know 22 now is Joey Logano who is the new driver in the 22 car, but we're naming them after drivers that I followed growing up in early 1900s.
Speaker 1:Well, I mean, you know the Model A, the Model T, so today's podcast is a two part series. When we started talking about this last week, I said we can't do all this in one episode. It's too. It's too deep, it's too wide, there's too much to this to try and get it in one episode. So it's a two part series and it was really spurred out of an article I received from a dear friend of mine that talked about the CEOs are now joining the great resignation. So the title of the podcast is why Are CEOs Joining the Great Resignation? And we're going to dissect just some of some from that article, some from the work that we are doing with businesses, some from the work that I've done previously with businesses, asking the question why are not just CEOs, why are business owners, why are leaders vacating that position and following the employees of the great resignation?
Speaker 3:That was that a Forbes article.
Speaker 1:It was a Forbes article.
Speaker 3:Yeah, Forbes Inc magazine. They do a great job, I think, of staying on top of some of these issues. I mean, we've got multiple articles about emotional intelligence, about workplace culture and environment, so they do a really good job of bringing some of those things forward.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I think they're raising their hand and saying you know, this is something that needs to be looked at, and I think it is a challenge because you can identify a situation or an opportunity. The challenge is, what do you do about it? And we talk a lot on our podcast and with businesses. We can identify, but now you've got to put a plan in place and then you have to execute that plan, and the topic today is not something that's easily accomplished. And how do we start turning back you know the CEOs wanting to leave and how do we start teaching or coaching or developing them to start gaining trust and respect for the workforce? I mean, that's not something that you could do overnight.
Speaker 3:Yeah well, there's a big divide there right between the CEO or the C-suite and the rest of the workforce in a lot of companies.
Speaker 1:Yeah, the article called a canyon. That's a big divide if there's a canyon out there. So, and I will say this for a long time, I've been around executives at multiple levels in company and felt there was an animosity growing between the owner, executive and the workforce.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I would say that's a good assessment.
Speaker 1:And I believe what happened is that animosity was building and then COVID just kind of blew it up.
Speaker 3:Yeah, covid covered a lot of things that were just kind of bubbling underneath the service, certainly in the corporate world but in a lot of areas of life, but that it seemed to want to be one where it is most easily recognizable because of so much that was going on. And then the kind of setting of the, of the mindset for the workforce.
Speaker 1:Then we saw really the employee workforce looking back at the company almost in a disdain, in what in the housing market they'll say it's a seller's market as a buyer's market and all of a sudden that became an employee's marketplace. Looking back at the company, saying I want to be appreciated, I want to be valued, I would like to talk about benefits and pay and they you know all these things start happening, which created a lot of pressure on the executive side of it, because now they had to deal with that. And how do we, after all these resignations, how do we restaff our organization? How do we talk about benefits? How do we talk about pay? I mean, how do we do these things? And the lens that the employee had in their mind of the executive or the leader? What good? For good reason sometimes, yeah, for good reason. I will say that there are some misunderstandings, that I think the uh and I think this is a communication issue I think the leaders didn't communicate well to the teams what was coming on from an economic standpoint of benefits. I mean we could just pause and talk about healthcare costs and the sheer pressure it put on companies by itself, retirement programs by itself, because interest rates were dropping, the returns on investment weren't as great, so the pension funds or the 401ks were were decreasing. And if it, if an employee is opening up their retirement uh account and seeing $20,000 going and $30,000 going and they're seeing their healthcare costs go up, they're looking at that executive, that leader, saying what are you going to do about it? And that that pressure started happening.
Speaker 1:So recently I had lunch with a dear friend of mine that I've known since high school, who was, uh had retired from the military as a, as a what was called a bird kernel. So he was a old bird kernel and much like a lot of retired um military people went and started skating a little bit, just kind of taking it easy, and found himself in a position where, like I need to get back into doing something because and he went to work for a large hospital uh organization and he asked me this question. He said when did the leadership executive and the employee relationship start turning south? Now he's two years out of the military and he's back into corporate or he's into corporate America for the first time and he's like man, there's a canyon out there of the vibe between the leader and the employee. He said when that started? I'm not. I personally think it started 30, 40 years ago.
Speaker 3:Yeah, at least, or at least current manifestation of it. There's been a lot of different iterations of that, but I mean, I think where we are today started had its roots back 30, 40 years ago, absolutely.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and, and, and when. When you think about what we've seen after COVID AC, remember AC yeah, ac, ac, ac, not the band.
Speaker 1:Not the band. When you see what, what AC created, you see that it just just didn't happen. It was a culmination kind of a a wave of things that were was taking place that now, man, it was like a tidal wave, just obliterated. And if you think about, we've we've used the statistics 43 million on average People vacated the marketplace at a company, resigned, and the number was 120-ish million people work. As far as the workforce, that's a huge amount of turnover in the population of the workforce.
Speaker 1:Trying to figure out right what I want to do, where am I going to go next? And then the company's having to get into the recruitment business. Almost like the professional organizations you know, sports organizations, they had to get into the recruitment business and the talent acquisition business and they brought on chief people, officers, a chief culture people and things like that, which that's a cost burden, and you got to bring those people in and start doing those things you hadn't, you hadn't done in the past. Was the animosity warranted? I think in a lot of cases there was a lot of reason for the animosity.
Speaker 1:I personally believe that executives weren't approachable. I think people skills were lacking. Um, this particular article talks a lot about emotional intelligence was lacking and mental health and emotional health started being degraded. And I believe what we saw and we've we talked about this as well is there were a lot of people put in positions of leadership out of convenience versus competence, and now we're we're seeing the effects of that with what's going on, with the leadership in America now joining the great resignation too.
Speaker 3:Well, a lot of the people that talk back in this article they've said they've been with the company 20, 30 years and so you back that up. I mean, that's the late nineties, early 2000s, when your start market was going crazy, hitting all time highs at that point, and it was all about the chair price and pushing things forward and, you know, kind of winning at any cost, and so that was a culture that brought up a set of leaders that are now getting into the top spots, that there wasn't a lot of focus being put on leading people well at that point.
Speaker 1:No, and I've said this and this is this this conversation isn't just about about publicly traded companies and their executives. This is small business owner founders that grew into in market companies. And there was a I'm going to say it was late maybe, maybe mid early to mid 2000. It became very popular for someone that was a business owner executive to drive a Harley, ride a Harley. I'd go into offices and there would be pictures of Harley Davidson, the pictures of, you know, driving through the mountains and things like that, and the we would talk motorcycles. I rode motorcycles and we would be talking motorcycles and it became almost like this right of passage for having a Harley or a boat or an RV.
Speaker 1:And there was a particular company that I was called into where there was literally an upheaval going on and as soon as I pulled up into parking lot I knew what the problem was. I mean, I looked at the situation from the outside and I said, oh, there's the problem. And this particular company, which was a tier two company for a larger corporation, the owner had built himself a carport shed type that you literally pulled up and under and then had a walkway to the door and the parking lot Executive, parking Executive, I, but I mean it was at the front Door with a sign and the Lexus was parked out there and you had this gravel parking lot, not paved, dust all over the cars, and I walked in and was asked to come that you know we've got a culture issue and walked in I'm like I've got, I know what your problem is Like.
Speaker 1:How do you know that quick? And I said follow me. And walked outside and I said see that. I said I'm not going to walk out, I'm not going to walk out and walked outside and I said see that that's your problem. He said how's that a problem? I said you just separated yourself from your team. You said my car is more valuable, it doesn't need dust on it, I don't need to get wet walking in here. And you just separated yourself from your team. I said tear that down and go park that car out in the parking lot.
Speaker 1:He did and it started changing the attitude of the team. So, as a leader, when you start separating yourself from your team because you feel like now you've arrived, because you feel like now you've arrived, you're, you're actually going to start degrading your team, because they start looking at you as if you don't feel like you're one of them and the reality is you're not one of them in the, in the aspect that every day you're not out there on that floor or in that manufacturing or whatever it is the company does. But the other part of the reality is is you are you just happen to be blessed to be the leader of those people? You may not be out there grinding away every day, but they also don't know the pressure that you're under to from payroll or increased health care costs or retirement, all those things. And if you don't communicate the challenges that you have in your position and listen, and then vice versa, you're going to get this canyon that was created. Yeah.
Speaker 3:I think that's a key point to rest on for a moment. It's a lot of the times it's due to lack of communication, because in a lot of lack of information you start filling the void, and most of the time that void is filled with negative thoughts, right, negative information. It very rarely do you come away with like, oh, I think everybody's doing everything in my best interest. It's especially if you've had any sort of negative experience. You compound that when you have a lack of information, and so I think you're you're right in terms of the idea of there needs to be more communication between the owner of the company, the C suite, the executives and the team that they're working with to try to accomplish the mission of that organization.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I agree, and after the break, you know, we're going to talk about a conversation I had with an executive that made me start thinking about this. Welcome back.
Speaker 3:Today we are talking about the fact that CEOs, both of big multinational companies, talk trading companies, small mom and pop companies. The CEOs are the ones that are leaving now. So we had the great resignation where the team started leaving. Now we're starting to see the leaders are leaving and there's a lot of reasons for that, John, and I know a lot of this was spurred initially from a convert from a article that you saw in Forbes, but share with us a few more thoughts about that. And you said you had a conversation you wanted to share with us.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so what has taken place didn't just occur, it was built over time. And years ago I was I found myself going to a business meeting where a lot of healthcare executives were at that meeting. And the day before I went to this meeting I started looking at compensation packages or healthcare executives and things like that, because I wanted to know the lens with which an executive looked through to substantiate the compensation packages both base salary, bonuses, stock and things like that, so I'd understand how they think. And then the lens that a person looked through that was denied health insurance coverage because they said that procedure was, you know, experimental or we don't cover that procedure because of an exclusion or whatever it was. And I saw that this was this is free Obamacare.
Speaker 1:Okay, so it's been that long ago when this meeting happened. But I want to read a couple of statistics before I talk about that conversation, because I think those statistics and that conversation kind of align with each other. But this goes back to the Forbes article where they said 70% of high level executives are seriously considering quitting their jobs, largely due to their emotional well being. That sound familiar.
Speaker 1:It does 57% said they're fed up enough just to go quit Like I'm just-.
Speaker 3:No, no, I'm out of here no two weeks.
Speaker 1:76% of those executives said that the pandemic had a negative impact on their personal health and 80% replied that they were considering leaving just to improve their mental health, because it was more important than their career.
Speaker 3:So you mentioned this, the first section of the show, but that's really no different than the workforce population. I mean, those numbers are very similar as to why people were leaving, the exact or the reasons they were leaving are very much the same. So, even though there's some divide in the community, there's some divide in the communication gap, they're all suffering from the same thing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I believe that both parties are looking at each other saying who's going to move first, and we're going to talk about toward the end of the podcast, in my opinion, who needs to make the first move. But I want to talk about this conversation I had at this particular event where I knew that one of the executives that I was going to meet their compensation package had them making around $77,000 a day, a day, a day.
Speaker 3:That's pretty fair.
Speaker 1:And so I was mentally, as someone that's a free market capitalist and I appreciate somebody taking a risk and starting a business and doing the things they need to do well to grow that business and have jobs and good wages. I believe in all that and I've seen it happen. We're products of that. With our company, you know we really work hard to be fair and balanced, have an even approach to growing the organization, not outgrowing things, and you know we talk a lot about what's next. But it was hard for me to understand how someone could look at themselves and say that's my value when you're denying coverage for patients and things like consumers. And so I had to ask the question and I did and I framed it with so I was up shaving this morning and I was thinking I'm going to meet some executives and I'm going to ask these questions and I said I've got to ask you. So how did you get up this morning and shave and looked yourself and feel like your value is $77,000 a day when you're denying health care claims? How'd?
Speaker 3:that go? How'd that go?
Speaker 1:Not too good.
Speaker 3:I'm sure there was a small pause before an answer came for that.
Speaker 1:There was. But the response was it's what the market bears, which there's truth to that. You know, if you're out doing that position and you've got an agent or representative and they're looking at other industry, professionals are in that segment and the monies and things like that there's. The market does bear. That Doesn't mean it's right, whatever. But then I asked this question. I said what's the moral lens you look to as a leader to be able to say that I'm comfortable with that? And that's when he walked off.
Speaker 3:I would imagine so.
Speaker 1:Here's the reality. Even as a free market capitalist, at some point a leader has to look at themselves and say morally what's the right thing to do for the person that takes the risk, that has the pressure and the stress to make payroll and pay benefits and all those things, and also take care of the team and make sure that I communicate the correct information, the challenges that the company has, and pay accordingly and show appreciation. There is a balance. We talk a lot about balance, but there's a moral lens that a leader and an owner has to look through, in my opinion, to be able to justify what I'm taking, what I'm doing, versus what the team needs, especially in today's economy where statistics say a family of four or five has to work two and a half jobs just to make ends meet. I really believe that this great divide, this canyon that's talked about, has been developed over time and both parties are looking to each other and it's kind of like a standoff at the OK Corral who's going to start first, who's going to move? And the CEOs in this article and things that I've dealt with and I'm going to say this is both article driven as well as things that I've dealt with they do deal with what I would think stubborn inflation, supply chain disruptions, economic impact, world issues, recession, interest rates, cash flow. It goes on and on.
Speaker 1:We have gone into companies and talked about communication under challenging situations is one of the best ways to come up with solution. Don't feel like, if you're an owner or a leader in a company and the challenges come up, that you've got to figure out the problem all by yourself A lot of times. Going to your team and being just honest, this is where we're at and this is why this is what it's caused us to be in. The situation is a lot better, because then your team starts understanding. But withholding information or just giving pieces of it creates a need, like you talked about. People start filling in with stuff and most of the time that stuff's not accurate information.
Speaker 3:Right and it really degrades any trust that you have established. But if you go in and ask for the help, it starts to build trust in ways that help them understand some of the challenges of the business. And you touched on something earlier. There is a moral obligation. I think that a lot of times we've separated those two things. In business we even have the phrase oh, it's just business. So that kind of dismisses any of my moral obligations because oh, it's just business. But for so long people have taken that approach that the people who were impacted by those decisions have no respect, no trust, no faith in the people who are leading the organization that they're in any way thinking about me and my well-being. It's only about them. And so when you open the door and invite people in to what's going on with the company, it starts to build some of that trust bridge back.
Speaker 1:It does. And going back to the CEOs and the leaders, and we're just and this isn't just, like we said earlier, this is not publicly traded companies. We're hearing this at the small business level, the mid market level and the large corporations the business owners, executives, founders are looking saying what else can we do? We can't please them. You can, you could have with communication, fairness and there's a lot more that we're going to talk about in episode two because it's going to be centered around all right now. What needs to happen? What does the leader need to do? The executive need to do to start building that trust and respect again. But it's not going to come overnight.
Speaker 1:But the publicly traded companies, those executives that were highly compensated part of that comes from stock. You know a large portion of compensation comes from stock. So the way the industry is set up, that executive has to come in and be just completely focused on that stock price because it's tied to their compensation. And I've had executives tell me at different levels of companies trade, trade organizations, whether it's oil, gas, insurance, whatever, banking that the pressure for that stock to perform on Wall Street is so great that they don't even dare do anything that's going to jeopardize the stock increasing every year because of pressure. And it's not like you get to have a great year and a subpar year or a bad year. The pressure to perform is so great.
Speaker 1:And where do you cut at? You cut at people. You cut benefits, you cut retirement, you cut perks. You cut things to a point where the people were overworked, underpaid, underappreciated. Again, it's not just the big corporation, it's the small business owner, it's the excuse me, it's the, it's the mid market size. The executives are now saying it's not even attractive or worth it to get these big compensation packages. And you and I were talking the other day about a boxing match. You know somebody get $15 million. I said I can run around the ring. I run around the ring for 15 rounds, for 15 million.
Speaker 3:I think I can stay away for three minutes.
Speaker 1:Right and and but these executives are saying, even with these huge packages based on their health, their family and that that's their physical and mental health, it's just not worth it.
Speaker 3:Well, if you talk about the idea that a lot of these CEOs again, no matter what level we're talking about, but CEOs, owners or companies leaders have underdeveloped emotional intelligence, so they don't really have the skills to deal with a lot of the pressure that's coming at them, so they could be looking for alternative ways to relieve stress and relieve pressure, which most of the time, are not going to be positive. There's just, it just makes sense. It's like there there's no amount of money that can help me, right, feel better, and so you have to have a release valve in terms of just get out.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you, you said something that we're going to talk about on the part two of this series and that's emotional intelligence being such a key component. And because that wasn't, because we've read the statistics that you know, Mackenzie says it's, it's going to become a top 10 factor. No, it's, it's way more than the top 10. It should be a top two. I mean, you should know, you should know about the industry you're going to lead. I agree with that. But if you don't have emotional intelligence, with a sheer pressure of the day's economic and societal climate, you're going to wheel and that stock price is going to go down and you're going to go down, and the employees are going to go down and the company's going to go down. So it has to be up there and we're going to talk about that. On on on part two of this, just the impact that emotional intelligence can do to help regain leadership in America in the marketplace. I'm going to, I'm going to say this, and it's probably not going to be popular We'll see if it needs to be edited out.
Speaker 1:The reality is, both parties are faulted at fault in this.
Speaker 3:Oh yeah, absolutely, that's staying in.
Speaker 1:I was. I was worried that was going to get cut and it can only be fixed and let me be clear it can only be fixed when both parties agree that they both have fault and both have a responsibility to help correct this. Okay, Absolutely. Now I'm also going to say that there has to be one party that starts, or they'll just continue staring at each other like the standoff.
Speaker 1:Yeah, somebody's got to start the conversation, that responsibility 100% is on the leadership. They have to admit we were wrong, what we need to do to correct it, and then come up with the plan, execute that plan and then show the workforce, the team members, the employees that they're serious about it. It's not just, it's just not talk. You know, there's there's a lot of companies that, when they realized that that the human talent was going to be a big deal, Started hiring all these people and said we're going to do all these things and we're going to invest in people and give bonuses and all these things. That a lot of that was just a lot of talk. But do they truly want to change themselves and the culture of their organization long term?
Speaker 3:Yeah, there's a lot of talk in popular culture about being seen and being heard and sometimes that can kind of be dismissed and push those aside, but it's, it's really true and I've been reading some material and studying some stuff. It keeps coming back to that as a key factor. People want to know that they are recognized for who they are, that their problems matter and that their contribution matters. Because if you don't feel like your contribution matters, then what's the purpose?
Speaker 1:Right, yeah, yeah, it's no longer. The employee is not as concerned as they were 30, 40, 50, 60 years ago about just the pension. It's a lot about purpose. And I don't again, I don't believe the leadership actually heard that they just kept thinking about retirement and bottom line and 401ks and benefits and stock price and all those things. And the employees are screaming yeah, but what's the purpose? And we don't want to work 80 hours a week and sleep and die. So the second part of this podcast series we'll discuss leadership in America at all for pillars, faith, family, government, business and what needs to happen to start regaining the trust and respect back from the population. And that's tough. That's not something, like I said, I don't know if our audience knows the show be which where she could just twinkle her nose and make things happen.
Speaker 3:Maybe the older part of the audience.
Speaker 1:But guess what? Twinkling our nose is not going to fix this. It's going to take rolling sleaze up, having hard conversations and then executing on well thought out plans that are thinking about respect from both the company side as well as the employee side. So we look forward to that and we hope the audience is enjoying this conversation about the great resignation when it comes to leadership in America now, following the employees that resigned during the great resignation and what can be done to help rebuild trust and respect.
Speaker 3:Well, thanks for bringing this up and we look forward to part two of this discussion next week. Thank you, thank you, thank you, you.